LOL well everyone should run a holset as a daily driver. It was hard for me to accept it, though I was witnessing it, but this turbo literally spools as fast as my small 16g with identical mods (I swapped between the two and maintained the same boost for the sake of comparison). It's a great street turbo with more top end / peak flow than many "race" turbos.

WRT boost I run, it settles at 28-30 psi depending on the nature of the weather now. Most of this summer I was experimenting with it a 25psi. Which at even 25psi, the heat from compressing the air is still too hot for pump gas and my 20" X 9" X2.5" intercooler. I run a 3gal/hr nozzle for a fine mist plus a 5 gal/hr nozzle for combustion chamber cooling; and run 80/20 water/isopropynol. This is the big h1c from the 1991-1993 INTERCOOLED cummins turbo diesel ram pickup. They have the 54mm inducer compressor wheel. It flows around 3 lb/min less than the hx35. This puts it right at the flow of a 50-trim and a hair more than a 20g.

I can run around town out of boost just fine without injection. The pump isn't activated until about 8psi. This is what almost ALL decent kits allow. So to answer the question: a decent WI kit won't be on all the time bogging the engine and running you out of fluid. Only there when you need it. At a certain boost. Now DSMlink lets these fuel injectors run just as if the factory installed them: perfectly stoich (14.7:1). 14.7:1 is ideal for fuel mileage and doesn't require knock supression when out of boost, as this is how the factory ecu runs you when unmodified and out of boost (closed loop). Beating around with it is just like any other dsm with 272-style cams. On boost is where things change. . . My dsmlink logs showed 2lb/min more airflow at 2psi LESS boost from the holset at the same rpm :) , around 5200rpms. The reason is because the wheels are much more efficient. More energy is converted to boost instead of wasted as heat. So less exhaust gases are needed to achieve a pressure threshold. Ball Bearing has nothing on simply more efficient turbine wheels and compressors.

Since it rises to 30 psi by 3400rpms, if I were to play with it at all, most certainly knock supression is neccessary for pumpgas.

very nice :banana:

i've been looking for this version or the hx35 but I can't find a vendor to sell the mitsu flanged BEP housing I need. I sent a PM on this

so if I calculated correctly from your post. the hx35 has a flow rate of .45kg/sec which would translate into 59.5lb/min. Subtract 3lb/min for the h1c equalling 56.5lb/min. Thats about 10lb/min more than a standard garrett 50 trim without mixing and matching housings which would be around 46lb/min = hx30. With a quicker spool time?

Nope, you got that from the holset website didn't you! Shame on them for that, since I have their published map and their internally used map confirmed to be the right map from a cummins engineer.

The Hx35 has a flow of .39 kg/sec. 0.39kg/sec X 60sec = 23.4kg/min. 23.4kg/min X 2.2046 = 51.6 lb/min. Yes the 50-trim flows about 49lb/min peak. The hx35 flows about 52lb/min peak. It also spools about 400rpms faster than a 50 trim, while the turbine still can support 500whp. So the hx35 is basically a 50-trim on crack. 3 lb/min more flow (about 35 more horsepower) and faster spool.

The 20g flows around 48lb/min peak.

Now, the run of the mill hx40 8-blade can flow up to 59.5lb/min. The internally used compressor map shows 57lb/min peak and a low compressor rpm. And the published compressor map show 60lb/min. The 6-blade high performance wheel flows as much a s gt4088r and spools faster.

Here are the 2 maps from holset:

:o what manifold flange does it use?

I'm not sure which holset you're asking about. My h1c bolts on. The Bullseye Performance housing allows this. The hx35 and h1c have the same specs on the turbine wheel, so the housign will work with both turbos. The h1e and hx40 have the same specs so both work with their hx40 turbine bolton housing.

The hx35 in the bolt on housing has delivered 500whp:

(IMG:http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/attachments/newbie-forum/85631d1216771330-holset-hx35-good-buy-bad-buy-dent-sport-garage-dyno-500whp-hx35-bep.jpg)
Teh 50-trim is hard pressed to do that with a larger .63 a/r turbine housing!

The bolton housing and the hx40 6-blade compressor have delivered 650whp and as fast a spool as a much smaller and ballbearing gt30r:

(IMG:http://www.dsmtuners.com/gallery/files/6/0/8/3/5/hx_working.jpg)
Vs a much smaller ball bearing gt30r: The power peak is earlier and there is more power under the curve. . . And of course, there is more peak power. The hx40in the small BEP bloton housing is just as streetable as the "baddest street turbo" and has about 100 more horsepower in it.

The "stock" hx35/h1c accepts a t3 flange but don't try to run it without a divided runner manifold and expect the same spool speed. The same goes with the hx40/h1e, which accepts a t4 flange. Running with a divide runner manifold usign the stock housign whould net the same results as the small bep bolton housing AND have more flow. Since the divided housing design is VERY much more efficient. And their housing sizes match up to garret divided housings that spool in the same relm as the small bep housing with similar size turbines. No one has reall run a divided runner manifold with a stock divided holset housing on a dsm yet though.

ok, i'm sold. where did you get your turbo from? Or where can we get the dsm-type housings put on?

I have a buddy with a early 90's dodge pickup with the cummings engine. He's about to upgrade soon too, any idea how i would know if his turbo is the right one?

Sorry about all the questions, but I am really intersted in this! The spool is amazing for being so powerful. I thought garret was awesome until now!

Yea me too! is there a way to hook one of these bad boys up to a 420a? cause I am about to buy a GS here soon since thats all available and I need a car by monday lol

Garrett tries real hard :460: .

Borg-Warner compressors are even better than holsets. They have extended tip technology. The compressor has their exducer tips extended and this sends efficiency through the roof. It takes even less energy to spin the compressor and consequently more flow can be pushed through the turbine since more gases are wastegated. The spool is just as fast or faster since so little energy is required to keep the compressor "afloat" at a cetain boost.

But the holset turbine wheels flow the most and spool the best for their size barnone. I'd like to see a BW holset hybrid . . . Like a mitsu garrett hybrid such as the fp green or red.

Anyway, be sure this is an intercooled pickup. The small h1c comes in the non intercooler trucks and has little more flow than a small 16g.

The bolton housings can be had from Theturbotrader.com Or froms timsturbo.com. . . They are made by BEP (bullseye power). They have a few left. Call them first. Their number is on bullseyepower.com . . . They are slow to make these because demand wasn't there a year ago. But business for these turbos has been exponential, since some of us have put out good numbers. Several, like me, have good numbers on dsmtuners and quite a few that don't travel the net much.

Here's some comparison logs. The small 16g is first. at 22psi. I went on to log 36 lb/min with that run: the small 16g was completely strung out!!! The second is the first log of my h1c at 20psi and 15 degrees WARMER intake temps IDENTICAL setup down to the location of the log (same altitude).

(IMG:http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/attachments/turbo-system-tech/81378d1205948049-holset-turbos-part-3-small16g-log-comparison.jpg)

(IMG:http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/attachments/turbo-system-tech/81379d1205948049-holset-turbos-part-3-h1c-31.2lbs-min-5200rpms.jpg)

2 more lb/min flow at 5200rpms at 2 psi less boost and 15*F warmer intake temps on an otherwise identical setup. . . The h1c has more power earlier than even a small 16g. A testiment to it's spool speed.


. . . A 420a is starting from scratch :bwekk: . Any housing will do with the proper manifold.

I just noticed you have a GS-T. How do you get the power to the ground?

Also, so what you are saying is, the BW would be a better turbo than yours? I'm just asking because they have some pretty sweet bolt-on turbos for us DSM guys.

Their compressors are but their turbines arnt. . . It's a tossup, IMHO.

I keep traction because the FWD 1g isn't that bad WRT traction. I have modified the stock springs and done a few VERY affordable things. a 1.960ft is very possible on street tires. And since there's less drivetrainloss and weight, the FWD can catch up with that kind of start :)

Sorry to the OP. This seams far off topic. But none of this is possible without water injection. All of this is possible for street driving WITH water injection. It was experimented with by nasa in the 30 and 40s and equipped on wwII aircraft, it has a long historyof working, it is the premier way to extract the most from your "street" setup and still actually keep it "streetable".

:laughing: Maybe....... :blush-anim-cl: I wasn't able to find the compressor maps anywhere for some reason. thanks for posting those.

I also split this off so we don't clog up the other thread.

do you run the plain steel or stainless housing? What is your global and dead time set at with those injectors? How tame is it at low boost (10-15psi)?

sorry for all the questions, i've read through some threads at tuners but haven't really found the exact answers

the welded mounts and geometry don't hurt either :P