Im thinking about buying a 3000GT, trying to get the twin turbo VR-4.. Im going to be 18 in about a month. And im going off to college, so I figured this would be a nice first car. A blend of speed, good looks and hopefully reliability.

So.. What are the most common problems with VR-4s over 100k-140k Miles?
How much more am I looking at money wise for repairs?

Im thinking that since its japanese its going to be reliable.. I hope im not wrong on that..

Thanks for the input in advance :beer:

1) if you're not mechanically inclined forget about it, these cars need maintenence every 60 k. Timing belt, water pump, tensioners, spark plugs, spark plug wires, air filter fuel filter. Yes the spark plug wires and air filter get changed more often than 60 k, but they all overlap into the 60 k maintenence. 2) insurance on a vr-4 will kill you. 3)I'd reccomend getting a 5 speed nonturbo, it'll be quick, trust me, and you wont have as much to worry about, but make sure the timing belt has been changed already, otherwise you're gonna have to do it yourself. Taking this into a shop for the 60 k maintenence will cost you roughly 1 grand. Doing it yourself, 300 bucks.

Wow, just 1k? Much better then the 11k we spend on our land rover over the past few years.. Anyway how much would you assume insurance would cost per year for a 18/19 year old kid with a VR-4... ( I plan on getting this car by next fall. )

The vr-4 insurance will kill you. trust me. i have an automatic 3000gtSL, its quick as **** and i love it. Basically their the same car just one is faster. go with Base model, the vr-4 should come later on when you have loads of money to spend on it.

agreed.

the insurance for me when I was 18 for a 93 VR-4 was quoted at $248 with a $500 deductible for comprehensive and collision... That is far cheaper thean the 99 Eclipse GS anniversary edition I almost got... Hehe... It was barely (like $15) more than the insurance on my 94 NA for the 93 TT

Just 248 per 6 months?
Im willing to pay 1000-1200 a year if needed.. I really want a twin turbo monster, if it will take a bit more to pay for it.. My father owns a ML55 AMG, I cant have anything slower than that.. ( 0-60 in 6.4.. 342HP..) For a suv that is =O. Anyway, what is the life span of a manual tranny on a VR-4

mine was actually monthly.....

I have a 94 VR-4 with 88k miles, no major problems, I bought it 2 yrs ago with 74k on it, you dont want one unless you are planning on keeping it stock or unless you have another "get around" car, my insurance is about 125/mo that includes colission, but I am 22, my driving record is good, and I have 4 vehicles i'm insuring...... if you wanna know all the problems with tt's, there's a website caled 3si.org, that's all it is...... anyways, they are awesome cars, mine on the stock turbos right now is about 400hp at the crank, the cars weigh 3800lbs stock, so they are rock solid at high speeds, I have personally cruised at 120 very comfortably, if you have any questions, ask me

Hey,

I have owned my 95 3000GT awd twin turbo for just over a year. If it is a twin turbo you are set on, I suggest the following:

1. Have the car inspected from stem to stern, ideally by a performance tuner mechanic who is also a friend.
2. Really read the service history carefully, and insist on things like lien checks and accident checks.
3. Consider a third-party warranty, but again, make sure you read all the fine print.

Problems to watch for:

1. turbos - if not given a clean and adequate supply of oil and the car not idled before shutoff, these will go in the 100K - 140K mile range, or even sooner. The front turbo is between the radiator and the front of the motor and is fairly easy to get at. The rear turbo sits between the transmission and the motor, and takes 10 hours + to remove as the transmissions needs to be taken out of the car to get at it. To make matters worse, a blown turbo could destroy the motor; make sure these are solid! My car has over 138,000 miles on it and both turbos are as tight as drums (I had the mechanic check the rear turbo when the transmission was being re-sealed).

2. timing belt - I have read that 3000GT timing belts are notorious for breaking if not changed on time. Try to buy a 3000GT that has had this done recently. The replacement of the belt itself is expensive enough (around $500 US), and damage from a snapped belt could cost you several thousand dollars.

3. Electrical - Consumer Reports have long standing studies that prove the most unreliable aspect of the majority of used cars is electrical. If you look under the hood of a twin turbo, you will see there is next to no free space; this almost always means you are going to be facing lots of labor when work needs ot be done.

I can tell with my car that the 3000GT is a very reliable car provided it is maintained and driven properly. You must either possess deep pockets, or really do your homework if you want a twin turbo. Good luck, I hope this helps!

Chad

Turbos:
You can check the rear turbo for shaft play in 45 minutes tops by pulling the intercooler piping.

removal/ install.
The rear turbo is not in between the engine an transmission. Whoever told you that is screwing you on repair prices. Don't go back to them. If they did change the "rear turbo inbetween the engine and the transmission" they don't know what a turbo is, and you should find a mechanic that knows his *** from his elbow. (or her)

you do not need to drop the tranny to get to the rear turbo. you will need to take the plenum off, and the downpipe(F-pipe). If you want instructions, ask. I'll tell you.

The rear turbo is placed nicely behind the engine, and infront of the firewall. If you pop your hood, follow the pipe that goes across the driver's side of the plenum, behind the plenum, and then heads down, that goes right into your turbo right there. It should be a black pipe from the factory.

the heat shields are a real pain. the precats can also be nasty. And exhaust bolts with 100,000+ miles are never an easy fight, but 10+ hours is wrong if your paing someone.

Timing belt
Many cars have timing belts. they just need to be replaced. It's every 60k. for the whole service, which should include new tensioner, accesory belts, and water pump it will be $1,500 plus or minus. this is not a job for an ametuer.

I'm not sure where your going with the electrical comments, It's not that bad.

These cars are expensive because they are rare. Most parts are fairly expensive.

Also, they are expensive because the average mechanic is just sub-par. they're fine for hondas, and cavaliers, but for any type of higher, rare automobile you need to find someone with experience. Most Mitsu mechanics have never turned a wrench on a twin turbo 3/S. And those that do at a dealership rarely impress me with there knowledge. It's not that they can't, it's just that the car is *So* rare that they see them, they don't get familar with them.

If you get a twin turbo, make sure the recall is done on the transfer case. even if it's done check it again. The dealers never want to do this recall, either. mainly because they are ****. You have to just about beat them over the head with a large wrench.

In response to Turbos:

If the tranny doesn't need to be dropped to remove the rear turbo, that is my mistake and probably a misunderstanding from a language barrier. I will clarify with him and tell you the answer. My mechanic is one of the top tuners in BC and compared to him, I GUARANTEE you don't know **** from your elbow, if I may borrow the expression. My main point is to be on the lookout for turbos for the mileage range the original poster mentioned as this is prime territory for turbos to let go if not maintained; VERY expensive.

In response to timing belt:

The timing belt has been done twice in my car and the bills were approx. $480 US, and this was at a Mitsubishi dealer (dealers are typically the most expensive). $1500? They obviously knew something as they were replaced by the same dealer at 60K and 110K and I am now at 138K + without issue.

In response to electrical:

I think it is obvious where I am going with the electrical comments: it is the most common troublespot for used cars (as stated by Consumer Reports) and therefore a good aspect to watch out for. I think the labor out runs the cost of parts on a 3000GT in most cases; I have about $15K US worth of service history to back that up . Especially the twin turbo, with everything packed under the hood so tight, electrical problems have the potential to pile up the labor. Saying the car is expensive because it is rare and blaming mechanics is a myopic and incomplete view point.

I did have that transfer case recall done, but good of you to mention that. It is a critical recall as from what I was told, the faulty case could cause wheel lock at highway speeds. Scary.

but I know where the rear turbo is. ;) And I promise you it has nothing to do with the tranny.

1,500 is a roud about price here in the US for labor + parts. you can see why we typically think the dealership screws us, eh?


I've had mechanics tell me that my turbos were aftermarket (back when they were stock). if you want to bring your car into them, be my guest. I've had to explain to the local mitsu mechanics how some parts of the car work. I've had parts that the local dodge dealership can't replace because there parts manuals /computer don't list a part number. (I have a dodge stealth, the "yank" equivalent of the 3000GT/GTO) They have seen maybe one or two of these cars. Now do you want to explain to me how I'm better off bringing it to them for trouble shooting, when I could find the local DSM shop and bring it to someone with a specialty in these cars?

**** skippy it's an incomplete point of view, but I'd rather have a distrust of all of the dealer mechanics, and steer people to a specialty shop then send someone to a local dealer that has no experience with these cars, and start hearing about th horendous bills that they will rack up.

I've seen it happen. bring in a car running poorly, the mechanics look up what problem in a reference manual they have opened up twice since starting work at the dealership (the good guys get promoted, leave for better shops, or open there own) and change a part. customer is charged. labor + part. Oh, still does it. check the manual. change part. labor + part. call customer. tell them it's fixed. they drive it down the block, and it starts acting up again. bring it back. tech works on it more. labor + parts.

My own car was in the dealers shop every three days, before I started to work on it myself. always fuel related. they just started changing parts at the front of the car and heading to the back. after about 600~700 dollars I finally got ****, bought the manuals from them, and grabbed a multimeter. after testing three components I found the problem. relay. oh, and I only had to remove the passenger side kick panel to get at it. three screws. not that big of a deal.

In case your wondering it's usually something ECU related. they change plugs and wires. $$$ they change IAC motor and maybe air filter. $$$ They change the PTU and coils. $$$$ ok, now lets change the ECU, cause it's the last on the list. big $$$$. when if they would have just tested the thing they might have found the problem. but most mechanics don't trouble shoot. they just whip open the manual, and start swapping (and charging for) parts.

You wanna go to the dealer be my guest, my way has worked for me, also. It's also the way I've seen less people get screwed, so it's the one I advocate.

Again, this was likely a miscommunication between the mechanic and I; I haven't had a chance to clarify with him about the rear turbo but I will tell you the correct answer when I do.



I like how you snuck that "eh" in there. Actually, both timing belt replacements were done prior to my owning the car at a Mitsu dealer in Washington State; the $500 price is in US dollars and from that dealer. I have never brought my car to a dealer since taking ownership and do not encourage people to do so. I don't know how you got that idea in your head, especially since I have already explained that I take my car to a top pro tuner. I said that the car was taken to a dealer, not that I took it there or owned it at the time. I too love getting in there and doing as much of my own work as possible and believe that if a person is not one of those people, they should not own a 3000GT or Stealth, especially the AWD TT's. I agree with all your points regarding dealers, though they are grossly generalized, hey?

don't worry big shooter, I know where the turbo is. no need to remind me.


heh. I'm from Wisconsin. ever been here? we have almost the same accent. I've been "accused" of being from Canada before... :P

We also say "aboot" like you guys. ;) We just eat more brats. :grin:



This is where I got the idea from. :)


this statement and...

this statement don't fit together real well. Also where I got the "goes to dealership" thought process from.

oh, and GO LEAFS!!!!!!!!! :banana:

ladies, ladies, we're all 3s owners here, chill it out.

I am thinking about getting a 3000GT also. I want to get the SL edition because VR-4 is very expensive. I then want to do an engine swap with a GTO. Does this sound okay? Is it possible?

engine swap from a SOHC is harder than from a DOHC, because they share less sensors, but both have been done.

Yes it is possible. may be easier to just buy the manifolds/turbos/injectors/injector resistor pack off a TT and then add a fuel controller, and what not though, then just run less boost at 10:1 compression.

Wow thanks for the awesome responses guys. Much help to me they are.

no problem, yoda